Later in the debate, Mr. Bonar Law admitted quite frankly the argument against treating all Ulster as Unionist, and he proceeded to suggest that any county in Ulster might be given power to decide whether or not it should come into the new Parliament.  It was plain, however, and Mr. Churchill made it plainer, that the Unionist leader did not speak for Ulster; Ulster’s intention was still to use its own opposition to Home Rule as a bar to self-government for the whole of Ireland.

Equally was it plain that the plebiscite by counties would not be unacceptable to Mr. Churchill.

The proposal for the exclusion of the entire province was defeated by a majority of 97 and the Third Reading was carried by 110.  A few days later the city of Derry returned a Home Ruler, and the Ulster representation became seventeen for the Bill and sixteen against.  This dramatic change produced a considerable effect on British opinion.  Redmond, speaking at a luncheon given to the winner, Mr. Hogg, indicated the lines on which he was disposed to bargain.  He would be willing to give Ulster more than its proportional share of representation in the Irish Parliament.

The debate in the House of Lords was marked by certain speeches which showed that public opinion had moved considerably.  Lord Dunraven declared for the Second Reading, though pressing all the line of objection to the Bill which had been taken by Mr. O’Brien and his party.  He heaped scorn also as an Irishman upon “this absurd theory of two nations which is only invented to make discord where accord would naturally be.”  Lord MacDonnell, whose administrative experience could no more be questioned than his genius for administration, held that though amendment was needed the framework of the Bill was good, and that urgent necessity existed for the change to self-government.  He alluded to the opinion expressed by Mr. Balfour in 1905, that the proper way of reforming Dublin Castle was by increasing the power of the Chief Secretary and his Under-Secretary, and thereby getting a stronger grip on the various departments of the “complicated system” prevailing.  “I thought so too,” said Lord MacDonnell, who in 1905 as Under-Secretary had tried his hand at this reform.  “It was one of the illusions that I took with me to Ireland twenty years ago—­but I am now a wiser man....  My observation of the Boards had convinced me before I left Ireland that no scheme of administrative reform which depends on bureaucratic organization for its success, or which has not behind it a popular backing, has the least chance of success in an attempt to establish in Ireland a government that is satisfactory to the Imperial Parliament or acceptable to the Irish people.”—­This was a repudiation of the Irish Council Bill of 1907 by its main author.

Lord Grey, a vivid and attractive personality, declared strongly for “such a measure of Home Rule as will give the Irish people power to manage their own domestic affairs.”  It was a conviction that had been forced upon him by his experience of Greater Britain.  “Practically every American, every Canadian, every Australian is a Home Ruler.”  But the settlement must proceed upon federal lines; his ideal for Ireland was the provincial status of Ontario or Quebec, linked federally to a central parliament at Westminster.